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Doug4Troy
01-09-2014, 08:18 PM
All Troy athletes to get drug tests

"Troy athletic director John Hartwell said Thursday that all the school's athletes will be tested for drugs after a series of deaths and arrests struck the university.

Hartwell said that all the athletes will be tested within 30 days. He met with staff and coaches and every available athlete on Wednesday to inform them of the decision..."

Complete story: http://espn.go.com/college-sports/story/_/id/10270800/troy-trojans-test-all-athletes-drugs-wake-deaths-arrests

srbtrojan
01-09-2014, 08:24 PM
30 days...Just enough time to get every known drug out of your system. Guess this is more the "idiot test" for those that don't have since enough to stop doing whatever immediately!

trojanbrutha
01-09-2014, 08:29 PM
30 days...Just enough time to get every known drug out of your system. Guess this is more the "idiot test" for those that don't have since enough to stop doing whatever immediately!

I'm pretty sure that's true for a urinalysis, but not true for a follicle test.

Trojan_Thunder
01-09-2014, 09:21 PM
In the article I read, I agree with the assumption that there may be more here then meets the eye. Not sure if drug screening would have prevented the recent tragic events, but I'm glad Hartwell recognizes the need for it.

Possum
01-09-2014, 09:44 PM
Why isn't this done every year, all year at random?

Hemi Man
01-09-2014, 09:55 PM
Why isn't this done every year, all year at random?

They do get random test.

Lego
01-10-2014, 07:46 AM
This is not surprising. John is trying his best to keep things from hurling completely out of control.

Very negative vibe inside and very negative perception of Troy Athletics in the outside world right now.

Got to hunker down, good time for some fresh starts all around.

FoulPolePhenom
01-10-2014, 09:25 AM
They do get random test.

Was it done by the university or was it the NCAA?

dgoebel
01-10-2014, 09:57 AM
30 days...Just enough time to get every known drug out of your system. Guess this is more the "idiot test" for those that don't have since enough to stop doing whatever immediately!

Don't Agree at all on 30 day notice. Do it out of the blue on a Friday or Monday. Needs to be done though so I applaud the effort.

I will add if this is NCAA mandated then they have to tell the players what can lead to false positives. I know during the D11 playoffs it was posted in the locker room of what not to take ( Tylenol, NyQuil, cough syrup etc).

Hemi Man
01-10-2014, 10:42 AM
Was it done by the university or was it the NCAA?

In the past it's been done by both. Not sure of the penalties enforced in the past by either organization.

Hemi Man
01-10-2014, 10:44 AM
Don't Agree at all on 30 day notice. Do it out of the blue on a Friday or Monday. Needs to be done though so I applaud the effort.

I will add if this is NCAA mandated then they have to tell the players what can lead to false positives. I know during the D11 playoffs it was posted in the locker room of what not to take ( Tylenol, NyQuil, cough syrup etc).
By reading John Hartwell's comments this appears to be put in place by the university.

Harry Baker
01-10-2014, 01:51 PM
I read it as WITHIN 30 days - not 30 days from now it will happen. To me, that means it could happen at any time between now and 30 days from now.

Hemi Man
01-10-2014, 02:55 PM
I read it as WITHIN 30 days - not 30 days from now it will happen. To me, that means it could happen at any time between now and 30 days from now.

I read it that way as well.

Greenaubtrojan
01-10-2014, 07:57 PM
There are two types of testing, NCAA mandated random testing and University mandated testing. NCAA typically majors on performance enhancing drugs and mandates once per year and at championship events. However, most testing for narcotics should be mandated by the university itself. Every University has its own testing procedures and penalty policy for failures. Drugs are everywhere on every campus and it is important to create an environment that can be "drug free" for our student athletes. More importantly, it can give a kid a "legit excuse" to stay straight. Today's environment is not the environment from even 5 years ago. Sad but true.

VestaviaTrojan
01-10-2014, 10:30 PM
This is no small declaration and has a fair amount of risk involved. When you test a group like this, you don't know what the outcome is going to be. I'm sure they have speculation but in my expereince with large group testing, there are always surprises. And, if your serious about dealing with the issue, then you have to take the same steps with your starting tailback as you would with your #6 player on the golf team.

Now, this article doesn't mention what the result of any postive tests would be... and I suspect they won't make that determination until they receive the results. I hope the university has teh backbone to do the right thing with the results regardless of the 'positives'.

It would be a good statement for all coaches to volunteer for testing as well if they aren't already in the pool.

Hemi Man
01-10-2014, 11:09 PM
This is no small declaration and has a fair amount of risk involved. When you test a group like this, you don't know what the outcome is going to be. I'm sure they have speculation but in my expereince with large group testing, there are always surprises. And, if your serious about dealing with the issue, then you have to take the same steps with your starting tailback as you would with your #6 player on the golf team.

Now, this article doesn't mention what the result of any postive tests would be... and I suspect they won't make that determination until they receive the results. I hope the university has teh backbone to do the right thing with the results regardless of the 'positives'.

It would be a good statement for all coaches to volunteer for testing as well if they aren't already in the pool.

FPaPx_-bO1Y

SoFlaTrojan
01-11-2014, 02:55 AM
I don't disagree with drug testing, but what do these deaths have to do with the situation?

The story does not explain how drug use was involved in any of the deaths. One idiot prospective-no-longer player shot and killed another player's sister. A former player shot and killed someone else. Another was run over somehow by two vehicles in a suspicious situation while in another state.

Did pot or cocaine turn these jackasses into murderers and a traffic homicide victim?

TFan
01-11-2014, 09:36 AM
I don't disagree with drug testing, but what do these deaths have to do with the situation?

The story does not explain how drug use was involved in any of the deaths. One idiot prospective-no-longer player shot and killed another player's sister. A former player shot and killed someone else. Another was run over somehow by two vehicles in a suspicious situation while in another state.

Did pot or cocaine turn these jackasses into murderers and a traffic homicide victim?

Given the ADs recent response, I suspect there is much more to one or more of these tragic events than has been released.

I am certain there is recreational or addictive drug abuse among an adequate survey of college students and the general population at Troy University. Let's not kid ourselves on this point.

It has no place in NCAA Athletics and undoubtedly HAS ALREADY affected outcomes of athletic competition both here and elsewhere.

I laud John Hartwell's efforts.

trojanbrutha
01-11-2014, 09:42 AM
I don't disagree with drug testing, but what do these deaths have to do with the situation?

The story does not explain how drug use was involved in any of the deaths. One idiot prospective-no-longer player shot and killed another player's sister. A former player shot and killed someone else. Another was run over somehow by two vehicles in a suspicious situation while in another state.

Did pot or cocaine turn these jackasses into murderers and a traffic homicide victim?

Take all your name-calling to an fau board, it's not welcome here. :rolleyes04:

TUTrojan
01-11-2014, 09:56 AM
Interesting correlation between this development and the fact that we have shown absolutely no discipline on the field over the last few years...

dgoebel
01-11-2014, 10:09 AM
Interesting correlation between this development and the fact that we have shown absolutely no discipline on the field over the last few years...

I hope not, but there is no denying the no discipline aspect on and off the field. My only worry with this is that we get several positive results which will not look good for the University or the programs. I pray that all come back clean and Troy can move forward.

Possum
01-11-2014, 10:29 AM
I almost guarantee that there will be positives throughout all athletics... The way it is handled should be interesting...

If it was me, I'd have 0 tolerance... These young men and women represent my university, they shouldn't be doing that mess... JMHO

Lego
01-11-2014, 10:52 AM
Interesting correlation between this development and the fact that we have shown absolutely no discipline on the field over the last few years...

It's not a correlation, it's a direct cause and effort.

Sorry but this is yet another sign it is time for a fresh start top to bottom

dgoebel
01-11-2014, 11:40 AM
I almost guarantee that there will be positives throughout all athletics... The way it is handled should be interesting...

If it was me, I'd have 0 tolerance... These young men and women represent my university, they shouldn't be doing that mess... JMHO

I was a bit puzzled by Hartwell's remarks. If they get a positive, they will get them help. If it continues to be a problem then there might be suspensions from some games??? That doesn't sound like zero tolerance. I can possibly agree on the getting help but they should be suspended during it. Second offense you are gone.

Bubba the Trojan
01-11-2014, 12:00 PM
I was a bit puzzled by Hartwell's remarks. If they get a positive, they will get them help. If it continues to be a problem then there might be suspensions from some games??? That doesn't sound like zero tolerance. I can possibly agree on the getting help but they should be suspended during it. Second offense you are gone.

"Under department policy, the first positive drug test leads to notification of parents or guardians. Hartwell said Troy will provide help to athletes who are suffering from the losses and those who test positive for drugs."

The above quote came from the ESPN article linked in the first post of this thread. I agree with you that suspensions should occur while help is being obtained but if, as it appears, there is a policy in place for handling positive results, that policy must be followed or the university will be exposed to civil liability. This is an unfortunate but apparently necessary step in our program's existence. We can only hope that the initial testing, coupled with monthly randoms, will result in achieving the solution to this and other problems, if indeed those problems exist. I applaud Mr. Hartwell for making this decision.

Hemi Man
01-11-2014, 12:36 PM
I was a bit puzzled by Hartwell's remarks. If they get a positive, they will get them help. If it continues to be a problem then there might be suspensions from some games??? That doesn't sound like zero tolerance. I can possibly agree on the getting help but they should be suspended during it. Second offense you are gone.

You didn't listen did you? He said if it continuous there would be suspension from games, and possible loss of scholarship, and suspension from the university. He never stated anything about if being a zero tolerance policy. Some of these people, if they have a problem, may just benefit from this program. No preferential treatment for anyone.

Troy87
01-11-2014, 12:49 PM
So, if you are an athlete at Colorado or Colorado State, and recreational marijuana use is legal in the state, can those universities hold their student athletes to a different standard than the rest of the population? Will those unversities have thier own drug policy banning recreational marijuana?

I do believe Pandora's Box has now been opened. So many questions follow this action, they are inumerable.

dgoebel
01-11-2014, 01:01 PM
You didn't listen did you? He said if it continuous there would be suspension from games, and possible loss of scholarship, and suspension from the university. He never stated anything about if being a zero tolerance policy. Some of these people, if they have a problem, may just benefit from this program. No preferential treatment for anyone.

I listened fine. "Possible loss". I agree with help on the first, do it again you are gone. Do you think that an employer will say " possible loss" of your job if this continues to be a problem?

It is "illegal" drug use and it is a crime if you are caught in possession of it. Being in your system is proof you were in possession of it. Do we look on this any differently than any other illegal activity. I do hope and pray that we don't have any positive tests and that we can move forward.

Hemi Man
01-11-2014, 01:25 PM
I listened fine. "Possible loss". I agree with help on the first, do it again you are gone. Do you think that an employer will say " possible loss" of your job if this continues to be a problem?

It is "illegal" drug use and it is a crime if you are caught in possession of it. Being in your system is proof you were in possession of it. Do we look on this any differently than any other illegal activity. I do hope and pray that we don't have any positive tests and that we can move forward.

These are student athletes. They are not employees. This program may save their lives or turn the direction on one of their lives. If we lose some games because a player is suspended, but his life is drastically changed because the university didn't boot him out, then I'm happy with that result. If a student athlete continues to defy the rules then that player should be removed from the team and the university.

Taking any prescription drug you aren't prescribed is illegal also. Drinking under age is as well. The sad truth is all those things happen on every campus.

On a personal note I'm all for the legalization on Marijuana. I do not smoke it and have no desire to, but in my opinion it's no more harmful than alcohol. In actuality I would rather be on the highway with pot smokers than someone with a good alcohol buzz. However, it is illegal and those that partake of it are subject to the punishment that goes along with using it.

Chasin170
01-11-2014, 05:06 PM
So, if you are an athlete at Colorado or Colorado State, and recreational marijuana use is legal in the state, can those universities hold their student athletes to a different standard than the rest of the population? Will those unversities have thier own drug policy banning recreational marijuana?

I do believe Pandora's Box has now been opened. So many questions follow this action, they are inumerable.

Absolutely….as long as the policies of Coaches are consistent and non discriminatory for race,etc etc then MANY aspects of culture (hair length,jewelry,bedtime,diet,music selection etc ) can be deterred by policy if it is deemed detrimental by a Coach and approved by a BOT.

I see no paradigmatic shift in present university policies with these new pot laws.

TFan
01-11-2014, 05:54 PM
So, if you are an athlete at Colorado or Colorado State, and recreational marijuana use is legal in the state, can those universities hold their student athletes to a different standard than the rest of the population? Will those unversities have thier own drug policy banning recreational marijuana?

I do believe Pandora's Box has now been opened. So many questions follow this action, they are inumerable.

Personally, I don't give a diddly what the Rams or Buffalos do/don't do. It's the best interest of Trojan Athletics to have the most competitive and cleanest athletes represent our school. I believe the AD has set the course to have less questions and succinct answers when violations are discovered. In the long run, Troy Athletics will be more competitive on all fields of play.

Maybe we can schedule those Mile HIGH bovines!!!

GO TROJANS!

SoFlaTrojan
01-12-2014, 05:46 PM
I'm so sorry if I offended anyone connect to the two alleged murderers! Really? You think calling someone who deliberately took the life of another a "jackass" or "idiot" is not appropriate? I'll bet they'll be called a lot harsher words that that in court and PRISON!

"Brutha", your response is idiotic.

My point, again, is that there is no published evidence that drug use played any part in any of these deaths. That evidence might exist and maybe the AD has heard something, but Alabama either has poor enough open records laws or poor enough media that the details of these indidents have not yet made it into the media.

TroyFootball05
01-12-2014, 06:54 PM
I'm so sorry if I offended anyone connect to the two alleged murderers! Really? You think calling someone who deliberately took the life of another a "jackass" or "idiot" is not appropriate? I'll bet they'll be called a lot harsher words that that in court and PRISON!

The murder of the 18 year old girl by one of our gray shirts was not deliberate. He picked up a loaded gun, most likely unknown to him, and it discharged and killed her. Early reports indicated there was alcohol involved, how much was not revealed, it was a new years party. I'm not saying what he did doesn't deserve a jail sentence, I'm just correcting you before he's labeled a drug running thug.

SoFlaTrojan
01-12-2014, 07:01 PM
I didn't know that. Was there an article somewhere stating that?

Play with an unfamiliar gun around other people and I believe you're an idiot.

dgoebel
01-12-2014, 07:35 PM
The murder of the 18 year old girl by one of our gray shirts was not deliberate. He picked up a loaded gun, most likely unknown to him, and it discharged and killed her. Early reports indicated there was alcohol involved, how much was not revealed, it was a new years party. I'm not saying what he did doesn't deserve a jail sentence, I'm just correcting you before he's labeled a drug running thug.

In an article I read, the Judge harshly got on him about mixing drugs and/or alcohol and fire arms. Very tragic. Alcohol and fire arms and motor vehicles have taken so many lives and forever changed so many others.

VestaviaTrojan
01-12-2014, 09:08 PM
Obviously more than this than what's been published. Lots of latitude in his speech about what will be done to offenders.

I don't doubt the NCAA has applied some pressure here. The number of tragic situations in such a short time has us on the radar for sure.

I did a brief check and can't find another instance where a university blanket tested all student athletes. Doesn't mean it hasn't happened. Just didn't find it.

trojanbrutha
01-12-2014, 09:53 PM
I'm so sorry if I offended anyone connect to the two alleged murderers! Really? You think calling someone who deliberately took the life of another a "jackass" or "idiot" is not appropriate? I'll bet they'll be called a lot harsher words that that in court and PRISON!

"Brutha", your response is idiotic.

My point, again, is that there is no published evidence that drug use played any part in any of these deaths. That evidence might exist and maybe the AD has heard something, but Alabama either has poor enough open records laws or poor enough media that the details of these indidents have not yet made it into the media.

No sir, you have not received the lion's share of the information and you're being an ass. When these young men get their collective day in court, it'll be what it's going to be. That evidently gives you the moral high ground in the interim, I'm guessing...