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View Full Version : Conference Shuffling - Part II



Troy87
09-18-2011, 07:40 AM
Here we go! The rollercoaster is going up the first hill.

"The ACC Council of Presidents has voted unanimously to accept the University of Pittsburgh and Syracuse University as new members"

Tom Dienhart

Now the scramble between the Big East and the Big 12 begins to see which one can gather teams so they can survive.

Will Oklahoma stay in the Big 12? Will they go to the PAC-12?

Big East now down to 6 plus TCU coming in next year. Does the Big 12 secure OU, and then court TCU to come back west and add BYU?

ThePowerMan
09-18-2011, 08:56 AM
BIG East and CUSA will gather up teams to weed out the weak in each. West Virginia goes to the SEC. BIG East as we know it will become a "basketball conference".

My bet is the Sunbelt looks MUCH different next year. I bet the Sunbelt weathers the storm and we are a 12-16 team conference. I think CUSA disappears.

Troy87
09-18-2011, 09:06 AM
BIG East and CUSA will gather up teams to weed out the weak in each. West Virginia goes to the SEC. BIG East as we know it will become a "basketball conference".

My bet is the Sunbelt looks MUCH different next year. I bet the Sunbelt weathers the storm and we are a 12-16 team conference. I think CUSA disappears.

Hmmmm. I don't see CUSA having enough "juice" to gather teams. The AQ conferences will gather teams, and the fallout will re-assemble and morph into new non-AQ conferences. A CUSA disappearance is possible, but I think more likely is that CUSA and Sunbelt merge under the CUSA name.

littlebittyschool
09-18-2011, 09:44 AM
What happens next is going to depend on what the Big 12 and Big East do. Are they going to try to grab teams from other conferences and rebuild or do the remaining teams bolt as soon as they find new homes?

From all reports, OK and OK state are off to the PAC 12. If this happens, then the Big 12 is down to 7 teams. So do those 7 try to add 5 or so more or do they just go looking for new home? If they try to add teams, I'm guessing they'll go for BYU and snatch TCU back from the Big East. For the last three, I'm guessing they'd go for CUSA teams like Houston, UTEP, and Tulsa. If the Big 12 gets really crazy and tries to go to 16, then that will pretty much be the end for CUSA. Especially...

if the Big East tries to rebuild. Right now, they are down to 6 teams (with TCU coming in next year to get 7). If the Big 12 doesn't fold, then the Big East will have Eastern CUSA teams, MAC, and Sunbelt teams to try to rebuild with. If this happened and the BIG 12 decided to rebuild, then CUSA is toast.

Which would actually be great for the Belt because some of the CUSA "leftovers" would be the teams that don't really fit in the East or the West. So teams like Southern MS, Tulane, Memphis, and UAB would be out there for the taking as well as La Tech. The Belt could snatch those up and find one more (Marshall might be hanging out there still, New Mexico State, or if they break up a former Big 12 or Big East school like Baylor and Cincy).

As soon as people can figure out if the Big 12 and Big East schools are going to try to rebuild or dissolve their conferences then it's on.

FliryVorru
09-18-2011, 03:26 PM
Big East now down to 6 plus TCU coming in next year. Does the Big 12 secure OU, and then court TCU to come back west and add BYU?

Yes. This has got to be the answer. The Big XII has to entice TCU to back away from the Big East, and then add BYU. Then if they can't get Texas A&M to be complacent they'' have to go and add someone else (Colorado State? Houston?). Either the Big East or the Big XII will fall apart.

If it's the Big East then the ACC, Big 10 and others can clean up the mess. If the Big XII falls apart I think college sports are in trouble. There's no regional way to pick up Texas, Kansas, etc. There are territorial overlaps between the Big East, ACC, MAC, CUSA, etc... but what about the Big XII? Nothing.

Troy87
09-18-2011, 04:27 PM
Yes. This has got to be the answer. The Big XII has to entice TCU to back away from the Big East, and then add BYU. Then if they can't get Texas A&M to be complacent they'' have to go and add someone else (Colorado State? Houston?). Either the Big East or the Big XII will fall apart.

If it's the Big East then the ACC, Big 10 and others can clean up the mess. If the Big XII falls apart I think college sports are in trouble. There's no regional way to pick up Texas, Kansas, etc. There are territorial overlaps between the Big East, ACC, MAC, CUSA, etc... but what about the Big XII? Nothing.

Actually, here's the way I see it:

The next step that absolutley HAS to take place is that the Big 12 or the Big East has to make a move immediately to start grabbing some schools.

The word is that the ACC isn't done adding teams, so that's a wildcard, but......if the Big 12 makes a move first, it has to be to secure Oklahoma from going to the PAC-12. If OU goes, OSU goes with them. If the Big 12 can secure OU/OSU, they can add BYU, which gets them back to 10. Next they will need to try and talk TCU into coming back west, but there are some hurt feelings between TCU and the Big 12 when the SW Conf broke up, and TCU wasn't asked to the party with the other Texas teams. But, I think they get TCU back anyway. After that they go after Houston or SMU (#3 & #5 markets in the country). If TCU doesn't come back, then they go for both Houston and SMU.

Now, if TCU gets wooed back to the Big 12, that leaves 6 teams in the Big East, which leaves them battered and weak. WVU then goes to the SEC. I think the SEC maybe goes after Clemson from ACC and possibly Missouri from Big 12, meaning the Big 12 is one short again. To replace Clemson and to get to 16 teams, ACC adds 3 more teams; UCF, East Carolina and USF. The 4 remaining Big East teams, Rutgers, Louisville, Connecticut and Cincinnati get sucked up to Big 10 giving them 16 teams.

The conferences then look like this;

SEC (16) - Arkansas, Alabama, Auburn, Clemson,Florida, Georgia, Kentucky, LSU, Mississippi, Mississippi State, Missouri, South Carolina, Tennessee, Texas A&M, Vanderbilt, West Virginia

ACC (16) - Boston College, Duke, East Carolina, FSU, Ga. Tech, Maryland, Miami, North Carolina, NC State, Pitt, Syracuse, UCF, USF, Virginia, Va. Tech, Wake Forest

Big 10 (16) - Cincinnati, Connecticut, Illinois, Indiana, Iowa, Louisville, Michigan, Michigan St., Minnesota, Nebraska, Northwestern, Ohio St., Penn St., Purdue, Rutgers, Wisconsin

Big 12 (12) - Baylor, BYU, Houston, Iowa St., Kansas, Kansas St., Oklahoma, Ok. State, SMU, TCU, Texas, Texas Tech.

CUSA (8) - Marshall, Memphis, Rice, Tulane, Tulsa, UAB, USM, UTEP

UTEP & Tulsa could go to WAC
Marshall could go back to MAC

UNT could go to WAC too

Leaving 5 CUSA teams and 9 Sunbelt teams to merge into conference of 14 teams.

troy4ever
09-18-2011, 05:19 PM
Actually, here's the way I see it:

The next step that absolutley HAS to take place is that the Big 12 or the Big East has to make a move immediately to start grabbing some schools.

The word is that the ACC isn't done adding teams, so that's a wildcard, but......if the Big 12 makes a move first, it has to be to secure Oklahoma from going to the PAC-12. If OU goes, OSU goes with them. If the Big 12 can secure OU/OSU, they can add BYU, which gets them back to 10. Next they will need to try and talk TCU into coming back west, but there are some hurt feelings between TCU and the Big 12 when the SW Conf broke up, and TCU wasn't asked to the party with the other Texas teams. But, I think they get TCU back anyway. After that they go after Houston or SMU (#3 & #5 markets in the country). If TCU doesn't come back, then they go for both Houston and SMU.

Now, if TCU gets wooed back to the Big 12, that leaves 6 teams in the Big East, which leaves them battered and weak. WVU then goes to the SEC. I think the SEC maybe goes after Clemson from ACC and possibly Missouri from Big 12, meaning the Big 12 is one short again. To replace Clemson and to get to 16 teams, ACC adds 3 more teams; UCF, East Carolina and USF. The 4 remaining Big East teams, Rutgers, Louisville, Connecticut and Cincinnati get sucked up to Big 10 giving them 16 teams.

The conferences then look like this;

SEC (16) - Arkansas, Alabama, Auburn, Clemson,Florida, Georgia, Kentucky, LSU, Mississippi, Mississippi State, Missouri, South Carolina, Tennessee, Texas A&M, Vanderbilt, West Virginia

ACC (16) - Boston College, Duke, East Carolina, FSU, Ga. Tech, Maryland, Miami, North Carolina, NC State, Pitt, Syracuse, UCF, USF, Virginia, Va. Tech, Wake Forest

Big 10 (16) - Cincinnati, Connecticut, Illinois, Indiana, Iowa, Louisville, Michigan, Michigan St., Minnesota, Nebraska, Northwestern, Ohio St., Penn St., Purdue, Rutgers, Wisconsin

Big 12 (12) - Baylor, BYU, Houston, Iowa St., Kansas, Kansas St., Oklahoma, Ok. State, SMU, TCU, Texas, Texas Tech.

CUSA (8) - Marshall, Memphis, Rice, Tulane, Tulsa, UAB, USM, UTEP

UTEP & Tulsa could go to WAC
Marshall could go back to MAC

UNT could go to WAC too

Leaving 5 CUSA teams and 9 Sunbelt teams to merge into conference of 14 teams.


All that thinking makes my brain hurt.

TrueTrojan
09-18-2011, 06:47 PM
ALOT of talk today of Oklahoma, OK State, Texas & Texas Tech being close to reaching a deal with the PAC-12. One major thing to watch in this is what role the Texas politicians play. They are the one's who stepped in last year & shut down this whole scenario b/c they want the Texas schools together. With Texas A&M gone to the SEC it'll be interesting to see if they try to step in again.

Fact: The Big XII is gone. Oklahoma will not stay in the Big XII under the current revenue sharing structure. Texas won't budge on the fact that they want a larger piece of the pie in the Big XII (something they'll HAVE TO DO if they go to the PAC-12).

My Opinion, is we see this:

PAC-12 - add Texas, Texas Tech, Oklahoma, OK State

ACC - already added Syracuse & Pitt. will add 2 of UConn/Rutgers/South Florida/Louisville

Big10 - add Notre Dame, Cincinnati, Kansas, will add 2 of UConn/Rutgers/Louisville (Missouri a wild card here)

SEC - add Texas A&M, Missouri, TCU, West Virginia

The rest - your guess is as good as mine

ThePowerMan
09-18-2011, 07:02 PM
I think Texas will get left out (by their own choice). They will not want to give up the Longhorn Network and they do not want give up the revenue. Therefore, they will be the next Notre Dame and become independant. Look for Notre Dame to enter the conference picture though. If they can't negotiate a new contract for TV rights, they will be searching for a conference.

TrueTrojan
09-18-2011, 08:44 PM
I think Texas will get left out (by their own choice). They will not want to give up the Longhorn Network and they do not want give up the revenue. Therefore, they will be the next Notre Dame and become independant. Look for Notre Dame to enter the conference picture though. If they can't negotiate a new contract for TV rights, they will be searching for a conference.

Let me pose this idea to you...bear with me

There's been ALOT of talk about 4 Super-Conferences (16-20 teams) creating a new "elite" level of college football (although I think I can speak for all of us when I say I hope this doesn't happen!!!). All with the idea of a playoff finally being implemented.

IF this does happen, you have the SEC, ACC, Big10 & PAC-whatever as the "Big 4". With each conference having 16-20 teams & ALL of the teams will have to "buy in" to their conference's revenue sharing, etc. With this structure in place....I don't see how the "Big 4" would allow there to be anymore Independents. I can't see it ever being the "Big 4 plus 2" b/c it would put Texas & Notre Dame at a HUGE advantage from a revenue standpoint. Texas & Notre Dame will have EVERY opportunity to join whatever conference they please...if they say no, it's not b/c of anything the conference has done. It's b/c Texas/Notre Dame are GREEDY & are in a sense turning their nose up at the CFB world. No chance the other teams/conferences will allow them a seat at the table. Nobody is bigger than CFB...nobody.

ThePowerMan
09-18-2011, 09:15 PM
Who would have ever thought Notre Dame would be able to get an automatic bid if they were in the Top10 under the current system? The problem is that when Notre Dame negotiated the TV contract it was big money. Now these teams are getting 20 mill every year. Their contract was like 9 mill. I think they could up the contract but I wonder if they can schedule enough games to satisfy the contract if all these leagues go to 16 teams. If these Super Conferences form, no one will want an "extra" game with NotreDame.

TrueTrojan
09-19-2011, 12:15 PM
Who would have ever thought Notre Dame would be able to get an automatic bid if they were in the Top10 under the current system? The problem is that when Notre Dame negotiated the TV contract it was big money. Now these teams are getting 20 mill every year. Their contract was like 9 mill. I think they could up the contract but I wonder if they can schedule enough games to satisfy the contract if all these leagues go to 16 teams. If these Super Conferences form, no one will want an "extra" game with NotreDame.

As it stands today, Notre Dame better enjoy their NBC contract while it lasts. They (NBC) almost didn't renew it a few years ago & if things stand the way they are today, they won't when this contract expires.

ThePowerMan
09-19-2011, 12:30 PM
That's kinda my point. These Super BCS Conferences will be getting the TV contracts and, at some point, ND will be left out. I think they feel that, too. You just haven't seen much talk about them in expansion talks. They snubbed the Big 10 and some teams might remember that.

redwaver
09-19-2011, 01:40 PM
That's kinda my point. These Super BCS Conferences will be getting the TV contracts and, at some point, ND will be left out. I think they feel that, too. You just haven't seen much talk about them in expansion talks. They snubbed the Big 10 and some teams might remember that.
It is sooooooo funny. The AD at ND was crying about the conferences changing and said teams didn't respect other teams and just wanted all the money for their conference. Hypocrite! ND stayed out of the BE in football just so they wouldn't have to share their big TV money. Now that same "dog" is going to bite them in the arse and I hope it does. No one deserves being taught humility more than ND. It could be they just might find it tough getting a schedule after all is said and done! How do you spell justice? Hey, that might just be out big money game! Go Trojans!!

TrueTrojan
09-19-2011, 02:41 PM
That's kinda my point. These Super BCS Conferences will be getting the TV contracts and, at some point, ND will be left out. I think they feel that, too. You just haven't seen much talk about them in expansion talks. They snubbed the Big 10 and some teams might remember that.

Very true. I think once this ball really gets rolling it's going to force Notre Dame & any other school who even has a thought of being Independent to jump on board with a conference. While Notre Dame (in my opinion) doesn't have the value to have their own TV deal anymore, let's not fool ourselves...they would still bring alot of value to a conference package. I think the Big 10 will roll out the red carpet & bring them on board. It's a win/win for both sides if this all shakes down the way I think it will.

ThePowerMan
09-19-2011, 03:06 PM
Let the Sunbelt go after 'em.......St Patty's Day year-round for everyone.....Hey!!

TrueTrojan
09-19-2011, 07:25 PM
Some pretty major developments happened today.

Texas & Oklahoma both had Board of Regents meetings today to address expansion to the Pac-12. Both meetings ended in APPROVAL for the Presidents to move forward. Oklahoma State & Texas Tech are expected to have similar meetings Wednesday (simply going through the motions b/c they're a package deal with OU & UT).

Last week there was a meeting in LA between higher-ups from Texas, Oklahoma & the Pac-12. This meeting reportedly "changed Texas' thinking a little" regarding expansion & the Longhorn Network. Basically, Texas has seen the writing on the wall & can either jump on board or be left behind. They're currently trying to figure out how to get out of the Longhorn Network b/c the Pac-12 (& every other conference) will not budge on the issue.

Also Conference USA is currently in talks with the MWC to potentially merge into one large conference.

Just thought I'd pass along a little info....

Troy79
09-19-2011, 08:56 PM
Some pretty major developments happened today.

Texas & Oklahoma both had Board of Regents meetings today to address expansion to the Pac-12. Both meetings ended in APPROVAL for the Presidents to move forward. Oklahoma State & Texas Tech are expected to have similar meetings Wednesday (simply going through the motions b/c they're a package deal with OU & UT).

Last week there was a meeting in LA between higher-ups from Texas, Oklahoma & the Pac-12. This meeting reportedly "changed Texas' thinking a little" regarding expansion & the Longhorn Network. Basically, Texas has seen the writing on the wall & can either jump on board or be left behind. They're currently trying to figure out how to get out of the Longhorn Network b/c the Pac-12 (& every other conference) will not budge on the issue.

Also Conference USA is currently in talks with the MWC to potentially merge into one large conference.

Just thought I'd pass along a little info....


TrueTrojan is right, here is the latest from the Commish of C-USA Britton Banowsky concerning a football only alliance: "We find the activities involving conference realignment fascinating. We are closely watching the recent developments in other conferences, and the potential for change. At the same time, we are working on some creative consolidation strategies that have the potential for positioning our members well into the future. We are particularly intrigued by cooperative possibilities with the Mountain West."

If we even want to be in the discussion, we best go ahead and put our name in the hat to petition C-USA for membership so when they get raided to make up the loses from the Big East, we can be considered a prospect for replacement. There is no time to sit back and watch what happens, otherwise we will definately be on the outside looking in. C-USA and the Mtn West would merge as one huge 20+ team conference to pit the East vs the West for a Conference title.

Go TROY!

TrueTrojan
09-19-2011, 09:23 PM
If we even want to be in the discussion, we best go ahead and put our name in the hat to petition C-USA for membership so when they get raided to make up the loses from the Big East, we can be considered a prospect for replacement. There is no time to sit back and watch what happens, otherwise we will definately be on the outside looking in. C-USA and the Mtn West would merge as one huge 20+ team conference to pit the East vs the West for a Conference title.

You're right. I sincerely hope that our AD is being proactive & seeing the writing on the wall, as well. We could not be/have never been in a better position for this to all be happening. THANK GOD!!
- 5 Conference Titles
- 5 Bowl Appearances
- New Trojan Arena
- More expansion plans in place
BUT we HAVE TO BE proactive in this process & basically force feed these conferences with how Troy could be a great addition or we'll be left behind. We aren't in a huge market BUT we have great quality on the field & a great fan base with tradition & unlimited potential.

As a side note, it doesn't look like the Big East will be "raiding" any conference. All signs point to what's left of the Big XII & Big East merging into one conference. It will be interesting to see what direction the Sun Belt & MAC begin to move. Unfortunately, my confidence in Wright Waters being proactive (or even cognizant) in this matter is extremely low.

troyaluminmichigan
09-19-2011, 09:24 PM
So, I know this might be radical but...............

What about new Big East with the following:

North
Cincinatti
Lousiville
Marshall
Ohio
Temple
East Carolina

South
South Florida
Central Florida
Troy
Southern Miss
FIU
MTSU

Creates a north south divisions, allows for a conference championship:

Creates some new regional rivalries, while maintaining others, against similar competitive schools.

It does do some wierd things to the Basketball conferences.

I was just looking at the Big East and thinking of defections of Syracuse, Pittsburgh, and assume that Rutgers and UCONN will go to ACC, and perhaps WVU go to SEC. Does leave TCU needing to go some place.

Yes, I know its radical, but hey, stranger things have occurred from Radical thoughts

TrueTrojan
09-19-2011, 09:43 PM
Does leave TCU needing to go some place.


Believe it or not, TCU is getting heavy consideration from the SEC, largely b/c of the Houston TV market & Texas recruiting base. SEC is looking at adding A&M, TCU, Missouri & West Virginia.

Looks like the Big East & Big XII will merge. As of right now, our chance is to join the Conference USA/MWC merger.

troyaluminmichigan
09-19-2011, 09:46 PM
Believe it or not, TCU is getting heavy consideration from the SEC, largely b/c of the Houston TV market & Texas recruiting base. SEC is looking at adding A&M, TCU, Missouri & West Virginia.

Looks like the Big East & Big XII will merge. As of right now, our chance is to join the Conference USA/MWC merger.

I believe it, and I know what I put out there is far-fetched, but it was an interesting combination of teams that I hadn't seen presented in any other form, that football wise would be an interesting match up.

I agree, we'll mostly likely consider C-USA next (or they us), just interesting to ponder is all.