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MeanGreenTexan
05-05-2005, 03:14 AM
Dallas Morning News columnist Gerald Fraley....

"Saw Demarcus Ware play in person in 2003. For the Cowboys to have taken Ware with the 11th pick overall in this season's draft means one thing.

He sure must have improved since that October night in Denton.

Troy, with Ware, lost 21-0 to North Texas at Fouts Field. Ware was credited with four tackles and no sacks. His performance did not register in the memory bank.

North Texas running back Patrick Cobbs was the story of that game. Cobbs, on his way to the NCAA rushing title, ran for 106 yards and two touchdowns on 24 carries.

One would think a defense with a future first-round pick in the NFL draft would be stouter. Or maybe Cobbs, scheduled to return from a knee injury that ruined his 2004 season, is that good."

Navarre Trojan
05-05-2005, 07:27 AM
I don't know who Gerald Fraley is, don't care.

Sarahbelle
05-05-2005, 07:34 AM
:roll:

Maybe that means that the NT offensive line should be starting for the Cowboys since they're "that good".


Gerald Fraley...bite me!

TrojanWar
05-05-2005, 08:45 AM
Seriously guy, I don't think North Texas State University wanted any of Troy's defense last fall. Just ask Missouri, LSU, and FAU...you know the FAU team that beat North Texas State University. Your great running backs would have been lucky to pound out 100 total yards against us.

Tums
05-05-2005, 09:05 AM
Dallas Morning News columnist Gerald Fraley....

"Saw Demarcus Ware play in person in 2003. For the Cowboys to have taken Ware with the 11th pick overall in this season's draft means one thing.

He sure must have improved since that October night in Denton.

Troy, with Ware, lost 21-0 to North Texas at Fouts Field. Ware was credited with four tackles and no sacks. His performance did not register in the memory bank.

North Texas running back Patrick Cobbs was the story of that game. Cobbs, on his way to the NCAA rushing title, ran for 106 yards and two touchdowns on 24 carries.

One would think a defense with a future first-round pick in the NFL draft would be stouter. Or maybe Cobbs, scheduled to return from a knee injury that ruined his 2004 season, is that good."

LMAO
WARE is a pass rusher and NTU is a running team. Ware still had 8 Tackles, (4 solos, 4 assist) 2 TFL's, 1 Fumble recovery and 1 QBH that night. If the writer would have checked he would have found that out of the 21 points the NT Defense and special teams where basically responsible for them (not the offense). All scores came off of Troy miss cues prompted by NT D and special teams play. IE Missed FG (NT offense made long drive), punt led to a 8 yard TD drive and a interception led to a 23 yard TD drive.
What a jerk.

faithintsu
05-05-2005, 09:18 AM
Great post Tums!!

Demarcus definitly had a great game that day, even though we lost. 8 Tackles and a Fumble recovery is a pretty dam good game IMHO, i dont care who you are.

BMarkey
05-05-2005, 11:37 AM
Another example, in a long list, of a sportwriter spewing garbage without doing his homework.

In the news departments of most newspapers, this crap would not be allowed.

troy4ever
05-05-2005, 01:07 PM
And last time I checked, there were more than one person on the defensive side of the ball. You can't blame Troy's loss that night entirely on one player. Why is this guy even writing sports articles He sounds like a moron.

MeanGreenTexan
05-05-2005, 01:16 PM
Seriously guy, I don't think North Texas State University wanted any of Troy's defense last fall. Just ask Missouri, LSU, and FAU...you know the FAU team that beat North Texas State University. Your great running backs would have been lucky to pound out 100 total yards against us.

The University of North Texas would have loved to take on Troy State's defense last year. Didn't seem to impressive against New Mexico State or Arkansas State, you know two teams that beat Troy State University. Our great freshman running back Jamario Thomas would have pounded at least 100 yards as he was on his way to the national rushing title and yet ANOTHER conference championship. What is that, let's see.... I do believe that 4 in row!!!

Good to see that Troy State fans can put a positive spin on a 21-0 butt kicking and make it look like close game LOL

TrojanWar
05-05-2005, 01:32 PM
Seriously guy, I don't think North Texas State University wanted any of Troy's defense last fall. Just ask Missouri, LSU, and FAU...you know the FAU team that beat North Texas State University. Your great running backs would have been lucky to pound out 100 total yards against us.

The University of North Texas would have loved to take on Troy State's defense last year. Didn't seem to impressive against New Mexico State or Arkansas State, you know two teams that beat Troy State University. Our great freshman running back Jamario Thomas would have pounded at least 100 yards as he was on his way to the national rushing title and yet ANOTHER conference championship. What is that, let's see.... I do believe that 4 in row!!!

Good to see that Troy State fans can put a positive spin on a 21-0 butt kicking and make it look like close game LOL

How many rushing yards did we allow in those losses? We struggled against the pass, not the run...ever. I don't think we would have allowed many rushing yards from you last year. Seeing that the pass was not NTSU's forte, I see that as a Troy win. Defenses win in an even game. I guess we'll get to unseat you as the Belt champ this year. In fact, I bet NTSU finishes lower than second this year.

BMarkey
05-05-2005, 02:01 PM
I'd trade our position for that championship, which was, as usual marred by the embarrassing season of North Texas.

Come on, you guys got handled by FAU, which wasn't even I-A. Early in the season, some people wondered if the green would win a game.

MeanGreenTexan
05-05-2005, 03:03 PM
Seriously guy, I don't think North Texas State University wanted any of Troy's defense last fall. Just ask Missouri, LSU, and FAU...you know the FAU team that beat North Texas State University. Your great running backs would have been lucky to pound out 100 total yards against us.

The University of North Texas would have loved to take on Troy State's defense last year. Didn't seem to impressive against New Mexico State or Arkansas State, you know two teams that beat Troy State University. Our great freshman running back Jamario Thomas would have pounded at least 100 yards as he was on his way to the national rushing title and yet ANOTHER conference championship. What is that, let's see.... I do believe that 4 in row!!!

Good to see that Troy State fans can put a positive spin on a 21-0 butt kicking and make it look like close game LOL

How many rushing yards did we allow in those losses? We struggled against the pass, not the run...ever. I don't think we would have allowed many rushing yards from you last year. Seeing that the pass was not NTSU's forte, I see that as a Troy win. Defenses win in an even game. I guess we'll get to unseat you as the Belt champ this year. In fact, I bet NTSU finishes lower than second this year.


Only someone with an Alabama education could see a 21-0 shutout defeat as a win :roll:

First y'all argue that DWare performance was due to him being a pass rusher not a run stopper, now you argue you struggle against the pass and not the run??? You cant have it both ways.

Did y'all have fun in San Jose while you were killing that bowl??? Apparently not enough of you did. LOL

Finally about next year.. Your great defense lost their best player. DWare has graduated while we have not only the 2004 rushing champ Jamairo Thomas coming back for his sophomore seasong but also the 2003 rushing champ Patrick Cobbs returning for his senior season.

MeanGreen61
05-05-2005, 03:09 PM
The Dallas Morning News blurb was posted on the Mean Green board. Here's the thread. You'll see that most Mean Greeners thing the guys statement was a joke and that Ware has our respect.

http://www.gomeangreen.com/board2/index.php?act=ST&f=1&t=21537&s=3af0220ae4590ff054ee9b3c92798701

http://www.nbcgraphics.com/logos/unt-logo.gif

MeanGreenTexan
05-05-2005, 03:13 PM
In all seriousness, this is just smack. I have a lot of respect for the Troy program. I was just posting Fraley comments because I figured y'all would be interested in the local Dallas media take on Dware.

I just decided to return some of the smack talk TrojanWar was throwing down about UNT.

It's all in fun, just talk. Afterall, Gotta do something during the offseason :D

TrojanWar
05-05-2005, 03:38 PM
Only someone with an Alabama education could see a 21-0 shutout defeat as a win.

I was not talking about that game. I was saying if we had played last year, I see that as a win for us comparing strengths. Oh, and I did not get my education in Alabama.


First y'all argue that DWare performance was due to him being a pass rusher not a run stopper, now you argue you struggle against the pass and not the run??? You cant have it both ways.

We had trouble against the deep ball. Well, let's not say we had trouble with it, but that was about the only place teams were able to convert longs plays on our D. I think our pass D was very strong as a whole. Most of the time, if the deep ball was not converted to kill us, we took it away. Most teams stayed away from the short passes on Ware's side as that would be suicide. Keep in mind that many teams were forced to pass on us because any kind of running game was put to rest from the start.


Did y'all have fun in San Jose while you were killing that bowl??? Apparently not enough of you did.

Yeah, we were the ones that killed the bowl. The local teams could not even draw fan support at that bowl. I mean they only drew 17,000 for UCLA and Fresno State. Both local teams! By the way, how many times has NTSU been to New Orleans? How many times have you won?


Finally about next year.. Your great defense lost their best player. DWare has graduated while we have not only the 2004 rushing champ Jamairo Thomas coming back for his sophomore seasong but also the 2003 rushing champ Patrick Cobbs returning for his senior season.

Yeah, it will hurt losing Ware, but I think our defense will be just as strong this fall. Especially against the run. Like I said, I don't think NTSU will finish the Sun Belt race in the top 2.

MeanGreenTexan
05-05-2005, 03:55 PM
Oh, and I did not get my education in Alabama.

Funny, I thought Troy State was in Alabama????


By the way, how many times has NTSU been to New Orleans? How many times have you won?

More thay you! LOL

How many bowl games has Troy gone to? How many have they won?

Face it, If Clemson and South Carolina would have controlled themselves, you would have been sitting at home last year too. The Independence Bowl didn't want you and it took the last gasp of a dying bowl game to take you.

TSU had a good year last year, but I expect them to return to form next year and be with the rest of the Sun Belt also-rans again

TrojanWar
05-05-2005, 04:20 PM
Funny, I thought Troy State was in Alabama????

Who said I went to Troy?


By the way, how many times has NTSU been to New Orleans? How many times have you won?

More thay you! LOL

Troy just became a D1A school. Tell us, how many times has NTSU won in New Orleans?


How many bowl games has Troy gone to? How many have they won?

Again, we just became a D1A school.


TSU had a good year last year, but I expect them to return to form next year and be with the rest of the Sun Belt also-rans again

Return to form??? Last year was our first year in the conference. Our past form would be National Championships, and yes, we will return to that form one day, only this time at the D1A level! Say goodbye to ruling the Belt. You will play second fiddle to Troy from here on out.

jerryopp
05-05-2005, 04:21 PM
It is nice to be in a conference where there is some competition. I know that our rival is suppose to be Middle Tennessee State, but I hate North Texas, because they are good. We will battle them every year (finally) and let the championship be settled on the field.
Good to have a natural competitive rival to go along with the traditional rival. Like Auburn is Alabama traditional rival but they also have a rivalry with UT.

TSUWhiner
05-05-2005, 06:19 PM
I am on soap box right now.

1. UNT you have a great RB..but I believe when I think of great RB's right now..and thats Oklahomas Adrian Peterson enough said right?

2. I would love to see UNT and Troy pound alacrapa and aublow every year..we hate them with some passion.

3. Eat at Mr. Hoes

4. I am off my soap box now

TUEngineer
05-05-2005, 06:33 PM
we hate them with some passion.

Speak for yourself... :roll:

Trojans1andAll
05-05-2005, 06:33 PM
All that stuff is easy to say when Troy and NT didn't play last year.

Just because DW is a pass rusher doesn't mean that the rest of the D can't be good at stopping the run.

Sure, we got beat by ASU and NMSU last year, so what? NT got whooped by FAU. What about NT getting blown about by Texas and our victory over Mizzou, and close games with LSU and SC? Can we figure those in too? It might be fun, but you can't call imaginary games by 'who beat who'.

Its good that most NT fans have some respect for Troy. I feel the same way for NT in general. I know its going to be a good game in Denton this year, but I believe Troy will win. I'll also be happy because after this year that contractual obligation will be over and NT can come to Troy next year.

Just be glad that DW isn't on Troy's D line when the Trojans come to Denton.

GO TROJANS!

MeanGreenTexan
05-05-2005, 09:19 PM
Just be glad that DW isn't on Troy's D line when the Trojans come to Denton.

GO TROJANS!

Why???? he wasn't that much trouble for us the first time when we beat y'all 21-0, I think that was Fraley's point to begin with.

as for last year...it's not how you start, it's how you finish and I think we all know what the order of finish was last year. Your ooc wins were great but if you could take care of business when it mattered i.e. conference games your fans could have enjoyed a mass exodus to New Orleans instead of a handful sitting in the rain in San Jose.

TrojanWar
05-05-2005, 09:25 PM
MeanGreen, you never answered my question. How many New Orleans Bowls has NTSU won?

The Sun Belt needs a team in the Bowl that can actually beat OOC teams, not just play them.

Hector
05-05-2005, 09:38 PM
MeanGreenTexan, apparently all the NFL coaches who plan the draft for their teams don't know what they are talking about, since they think Demarcus Ware is pretty good. In fact the Cowboys have about 6 million reasons to show their confidence in him. BTW, how many first-rounders did NT send in the draft? How many draft choices period? Did they send more free agents than TROY? There ya go, my friend.

MeanGreen61
05-05-2005, 09:42 PM
MeanGreen, you never answered my question. How many New Orleans Bowls has NTSU won?

The Sun Belt needs a team in the Bowl that can actually beat OOC teams, not just play them.

North Texas has won 1 of 4 New Orleans Bowls. Lost to Colorado State, Beat Cincinnati, Lost to Memphis, Lost to Southern Mississippi.

Calling North Texas by NTSU means one of two things. 1. You are not well informed as we've been UNT for 18 years. 2. You're making a feeble attempt to flame.

Have a nice day 8)

TrojanWar
05-05-2005, 09:44 PM
Nah, I just like NTSU better.

MeanGreen61
05-05-2005, 09:47 PM
Nah, I just like NTSU better.

Oh, it's a mental thing...OK

MeanGreen61
05-05-2005, 09:52 PM
MeanGreenTexan, apparently all the NFL coaches who plan the draft for their teams don't know what they are talking about, since they think Demarcus Ware is pretty good. In fact the Cowboys have about 6 million reasons to show their confidence in him. BTW, how many first-rounders did NT send in the draft? How many draft choices period? Did they send more free agents than TROY? There ya go, my friend.

Hector as I posted previously, most people on the Mean Green board disagree with the writer & have a lot of respect for Ware. Check the thread.

No 1st rounders this year, but we've had several in the past.

TrojanWar
05-05-2005, 09:58 PM
Nah, I just like NTSU better.

Oh, it's a mental thing...OK

I guess that's what you could call it. At any rate, I look forward to the rivalry already being fueled. This may just give me a reason to make this another road game I am able to attend. It should be fun game for many years.

MeanGreenTexan
05-05-2005, 09:58 PM
MeanGreen, you never answered my question. How many New Orleans Bowls has NTSU won?

The Sun Belt needs a team in the Bowl that can actually beat OOC teams, not just play them.

If you really need me to answer that ok. One.

vs Cincy in 2002

That's still more bowl victories than troy state, so what's you point?

Yes the Belt needs a team in Bowls that actually beat OOC teams, but that's something troy state has yet to do. Y'all are still winless against OOC competition in bowl games

TrojanWar
05-05-2005, 10:00 PM
MeanGreen, you never answered my question. How many New Orleans Bowls has NTSU won?

The Sun Belt needs a team in the Bowl that can actually beat OOC teams, not just play them.

If you really need me to answer that ok. One.

vs Cincy in 2002

That's still more bowl victories than troy state, so what's you point?

Yes the Belt needs a team in Bowls that actually beat OOC teams, but that's something troy state has yet to do. Y'all are still winless against OOC competition in bowl games

It's hard to argue with that! Of course, how many opportunities have we had? How long have we been D1A?

BMarkey
05-05-2005, 10:01 PM
Troy State will never win a I-A bowl game.

You show your ignorance of the game and conference.

Trojans1andAll
05-05-2005, 10:12 PM
Just be glad that DW isn't on Troy's D line when the Trojans come to Denton.

GO TROJANS!

Why???? he wasn't that much trouble for us the first time when we beat y'all 21-0, I think that was Fraley's point to begin with.

as for last year...it's not how you start, it's how you finish and I think we all know what the order of finish was last year. Your ooc wins were great but if you could take care of business when it mattered i.e. conference games your fans could have enjoyed a mass exodus to New Orleans instead of a handful sitting in the rain in San Jose.

Its called reading comprehension...

Like you've already been told, your win in Denton was because of our pitiful offense, not our defense. And DW was only one person.

Troy was the first team in the Sun Belt to be invited to a bowl that wasn't already obligated to the Sun Belt by a contract. We did it in our first year of eligibility. We have produced the Sun Belt's first ever first round NFL draft pick.

You insist on bragging about winning a conference championship in a season when NT didn't play Troy. It doesn't really matter that we lost to ASU or NMSU because none of it means that we would lose to NT. Besides, we still finished ahead of those two schools anyway.

Acknowledged, NT has won the Sun Belt four times, but only once since Troy has been a member, so don't get used to it.

GO TROJANS!

BMarkey
05-05-2005, 10:46 PM
I was pretty proud of the 3,000 or so Troy fans in San Jose. For a school Troy's size, for the distance, the time of year, the weather, that wasn't bad.

Our offensive coordinator lost that game for us. Troy dominated much of the time of play and had a chance to win late.

For now, I would rather have some marquee OOC wins than a SunBelt title. Frankly, it means more in naitonal recognition to beat (and even almost beat ... a la LSU) some big boys - until the SunBelt develops a better rep.

goe1975
05-05-2005, 11:38 PM
So exactly how many players did North Texas have in the first round of the NFL draft? BTW, I lived in Dallas a few years ago. I will admit that your school's music program is second to none. But when I lived there, I had no clue your school even had a football team. Seriously.

Lord-Mustang
05-05-2005, 11:59 PM
Oh good lord people...this is exactly why some people have started a "different" board to go to. I can understand a small amount of "Smack Talk"...but 3 pages worth? Come On! Let's just say....it would be great if the Sunbelt has an awesome showing this fall across the nation and good luck to both teams when we meet. I'm sure everyone wishes their respective team will win. As for who did what in the past...that's just it...it's the past. Only time will tell if each years teams can match up with previous years. Us Sunbelt teams need to stick together.

faithintsu
05-06-2005, 12:19 AM
Well put my friend!!

TUTrojan
05-06-2005, 07:58 AM
Nobody mentioned the beating Sunbelt conference champion UNT took against I-AA Troy State several years ago?

Why only bring up the 21-0 game that our pitiful offense handed you guys that year?

Almost like UAB fans savoring that 26-24 win we gave them when we fumbled inside the 5-yard line like ten times, even though we have outscored them 200-12 in all the other games we have played against them and won...

MeanGreenTexan
05-06-2005, 08:19 AM
Oh good lord people...this is exactly why some people have started a "different" board to go to. I can understand a small amount of "Smack Talk"...but 3 pages worth? Come On! Let's just say....it would be great if the Sunbelt has an awesome showing this fall across the nation and good luck to both teams when we meet. I'm sure everyone wishes their respective team will win. As for who did what in the past...that's just it...it's the past. Only time will tell if each years teams can match up with previous years. Us Sunbelt teams need to stick together.

Well put. The smack talk has been fun but it's just that...smack. Hope I didn't put anybody's nose out of joint, just having fun returning the smack that TrojanWar started about UNT. I agree with you that the SunBelt as a whole has to do a lot better in OOC wins to get more respect. Although I think comparing your win last year against a 5-6 Missouri team to our loss to an 11-1, top 5 ranked Texas team isn't comparing apples to apples. It would be like us comparing our win over Baylor the year before with your loss to Kansas St that year. Anyway thats all besides the point. I think you'll see more OOC wins this year from UNT since we have some winnable games against Tulsa and La Tech, in 2006 we add SMU to the schedule. I also believe that for the SunBelt to grow, somebody else needs to go to New Orleans Bowl for a change. UNT fans are becoming a bit complacant about gong to the Big Easy each December, don't get me wrong. We Love it, but I'm ready for a change. If I had my druthers I'd like to see us keep the conference winning streak in tact but take an invitation to another bowl next year.

MeanGreenTexan
05-06-2005, 08:24 AM
Troy State will never win a I-A bowl game.

You show your ignorance of the game and conference.

I only used the Troy State moniker because TrojanWar uses NTSU, it's been over 15 years since we changed to UNT but some people still show an ignorance of the game and conference by still referring to an obsolete name.

TrojanWar
05-06-2005, 08:36 AM
Oh good lord people...this is exactly why some people have started a "different" board to go to. I can understand a small amount of "Smack Talk"...but 3 pages worth? Come On! Let's just say....it would be great if the Sunbelt has an awesome showing this fall across the nation and good luck to both teams when we meet. I'm sure everyone wishes their respective team will win. As for who did what in the past...that's just it...it's the past. Only time will tell if each years teams can match up with previous years. Us Sunbelt teams need to stick together.

If we can't talk smack with a rival school, then what would you like us to discuss? That's one of the main reasons sports message boards thrive. Lighten up a bit. Nothing degrading has been said by either party, we have had a healthy bit of smack. If you don't like smack talk, then don't post any.

Lord-Mustang
05-06-2005, 08:39 AM
That's the whole problem. It's like the Energizer Bunny, "It keeps going and going and going". Learn to let it die and move on instead of this. Find a different topic besides "Our team is better than your team".

TrojanWar
05-06-2005, 08:43 AM
I'm not going to argue with you. It would be a stupid argument. I think you need to let things go as long as nothing negative is being said. There is no need in you deciding how long we can smack talk. In case you haven't noticed, there were threads that went an awful lot longer than this during football season with rival posters. That's probably the #1 thing I like most about sports message boards. Also, consider the time of year. Outside of baseball, we are in need of sports. There is just not a lot of hot topics going on at this time. If you have something better we can talk about, then by all means start the thread and let's do it.

Lord-Mustang
05-06-2005, 08:53 AM
Well...I have several topics we could be discussing, like...the newest academic building, the renovation of a portion of Bibb Graves Hall, talk of a new sports arena, how about even the construction of a new Fraternity Row? Academic Programs under review for enhancements, latest list of retirements, apparrel, why the sun shines? and a hundred of other topics as well. But you know something? People in general like smack-talk. They love to see just how far they can push people, and then push some more. After a while though, it gets completely pointless, like this thread has. I didn't mean that you shouldn't talk trash to each other...just don't let it drag on forever and ever.

TrojanWar
05-06-2005, 09:13 AM
I have to agree with you on that one. Consider this...all smack talk is pointless from the word go. That does not mean it's not fun for some of us, even if we go on for 20 pages. If you get bored of it, then of course you don't have to participate. Just keep in mind that we all have different interest when it comes to message board topics. You are right that it's time to let this thread die. It's even got off track from the smack talk.

troystfan
05-06-2005, 09:59 AM
Well, I see both sides of this issue: to talk smack or not to talk smack. It doesn't bother me directly per se, but I do have my own opinion.

Many on this board simply loath two of our other state universities. Although I am not one of those who depise them at all, I do dislike the arrogance and haughtiness of most of their fans. Fans who have never set foot nor brain in a college classroom a day in their life and yet they feel so obsessed by their chosen team that they are willing to rant and rave on and on about the school/team. (Paul Finebaum show).

Having said that, the only concern I have is that some of us may seem to have the same conceit when it comes to our beloved Trojans. We sometimes belittle other programs while we place our own high on a pedestal. The Trojans are destined for great things to be sure, we should just remember who we are and try not to sound like most of those Aubs or Bammers.

However, a little smack talk, in moderation, does make things interesting. So, I hope the MeanGreen fans will at least tune in to the NO Bowl this year to see Troy take care of a little business, just like we will have done a little earlier in Denton.

FHBrian
05-06-2005, 11:08 AM
Well...I have several topics we could be discussing, like...the newest academic building, the renovation of a portion of Bibb Graves Hall, talk of a new sports arena, how about even the construction of a new Fraternity Row? Academic Programs under review for enhancements, latest list of retirements, apparrel, why the sun shines? and a hundred of other topics as well. But you know something? People in general like smack-talk. They love to see just how far they can push people, and then push some more. After a while though, it gets completely pointless, like this thread has. I didn't mean that you shouldn't talk trash to each other...just don't let it drag on forever and ever.

Isn't this the football Forum? Most of that can be talked about in another forum. I would love to dicuss other aspects of Troy University, but sports is what interests most people here.

faithintsu
05-06-2005, 12:52 PM
yeah Lord-Mustang was just making a point there, of other things that can be discussed, did not mean to in this thread.